do we want science to tell us who we are

[Anonymous]

Hello ,
I spent from the age of 10 to the Age 14 in Hospital as I was fitting and lost ability too walk. I was diagnosed as Schizo , Epeliptic or just mentally ill ,tested for everything and given untested Drugs and Pain Killers too see if it would Help ! When I turned 13 a visiting Professor from America figured out I had a very rare disease and Operated successfully ! It was discussed if they could give me Medication too adress my wanting too be a girl !
From my perspective if they had Knowledge they have now a simple blood test would have showed I had Neuro -Fibromatosa and I would not have lost 4 very important Years of my life !
So a test to determine I might carry a Gene that may make me Transgendered would have been very welcome too me and Maybee just Maybee my family would not have abandoned me as a sick Mentally Deranged Child ! : )

[Anonymous]

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The trouble with “scientific discoveries” is that people take them as being black and white, true and false. But most medical research is based on probability and sample sizes. It isn’t an exact science. So I imagine we could find people latching onto some poorly executed research and labeling gender diverse people as having some defect or abnormality.

That’s true, but it is all we have to go on. Gender and sexual psychology (or psychology/psychiatry generally) is an especially contentious area and neuroscience, while revealing some incredible insights into brain function, is still in its infancy.

Some people, as we have seen here, just don’t want to see the Wiz behind the curtain pulling the strings; they’re OK with living out the hand they’ve been dealt (this is also true of the general population regarding, say, scientific studies on love). I think the level of comfort that people have with their gender is relevant to other non-gender related factors, such as a person’s general disposition. From what I’ve seen, transgendered people with more outgoing personalities tend to come out a lot sooner, or even reveal their transgendered nature as soon as they recognise it in childhood. Conversely, I’m quite a reserved and private person, so it’s more likely that I’m going to keep what I perceive to be my feminine side private and closeted (my use of the word “perceive” relates to how well we can know the thoughts and feelings of other minds. See “qualia”). This also likely means that throughout my life I’m going to seek out or gravitate towards more conventional, binary gender behaviours (because I present publicly as a binary male), which in turn causes more of a psychological disturbance.

Now I don’t know whether my private personality has any influence of my current thinking, but I have a strong suspicion that gender is all about learned behaviours. Now, I know what kind of response this gets from the transgendered community, so I just want to make it clear that my beliefs are strictly about me, not about you (as in anyone reading this thread). That is, I’m not attempting to make a generalisation about GID, but rather thinking things through for myself. After all, the consequences of making a wrong decision could be catastrophic.

Currently I’m writing a paper on the idea of gender as a learned trait, with respect to brain plasticity, determinism and evidence pointing to the lack of a singular consciousness, or “I” (that’s right, there is no Wiz!).

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What if the theory yields a test that would show if you were gender diverse?
How would you feel if you “failed” the test – but inside you knew you were gender diverse.
It would be you vs the scientific community.

Well, I think the dystopian society you paint here reflects, perhaps justifiably, a fairly cynical outlook. While I might rethink my own life path after discovering that there was no biological marker for my GID – making the assumption that if my behaviour was learned I could unlearn it (which, by the way, I wouldn’t consider a “cure”) – I don’t see why others should feel insecure or be persecuted for identifying as female.

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The fact that the research could be flawed, or doesn’t apply to everyone wouldn’t worry the average punter – who likes and seeks simplicity in their life.

Grey areas are always spurned by people who seek out simplicity. With or without the science, many people will always be threatened by difference.

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Well, few of us who are gender diverse could describe our life as simple.
And the last thing we want is people trying to simplify it in ways that could divide us, could make some people feel inferior to others, open the prospect of a “treatment”….
Now I need to think how I could stop the “do-gooders” carrying out the research I don’t want!

Again, I don’t think knowledge is the enemy here. Are you really suggesting that we quash scientific research into gender because it may upset some people? As you point out, many transgendered people suffer an enormous amount of stress and suicide looms large. Many transgendered people, including myself, become totally paralysed by the decisions they have to (or don’t want to) make about key aspects of their lives. As it looks pretty clear that I’m going to lose my family (a young son with very my long-term GF) over my gender dysphoria, is it really a surprise that I’d like to better understand why I am the way that I am?

I constantly have thoughts of fully transitioning, but I also have equally nagging doubts about the nature of these thoughts. If I were to discover that my gender was derived by either nature, nurture or some measure of both, there’s a chance that I could reconcile my internal conflicts and/or make better decisions about where I’d like the rest of my life to head. As it currently stands, we have psychiatrists telling us that GID never leaves you (like alcohol or gambling addictions) and can only be mitigated, contained or realised, which is quite a bleak prognosis if you really have no idea which way to jump. I sometimes wonder how other transgendered people can be so sure about their ultimate decisions; it’s a surety that only serves to further feed my doubts.

[Anonymous]

I’m sure there are many scientific theories for many things in general. How about this for one: Those that identify they have a gender issue should look at the genes and make up of their own family blood lines!

Maybe this is why parents and siblings are generally more accepting of transgender identity. We are made up from a cocktail of our parents genes and life’s expressions. I for one can accept some scientific statements but prefer to think its an emotional state we try to identify with. After all we are, all of us, trying to identify with who we are and the needs we require to continue through life’s journey.