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Labels.. do we need them, should we have common definitions?
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Quote:There is no need to make an apology Amy (as Amanda said) because we are having a good, sensible discussion as a result.
..and one that was needed I think – which is why I picked up Amy’s concerns (and my own) and created a post…
Quote:We all have different issues with things of this nature while participating in society and a good talk is sometimes all that any of us need to get through the hassles that we have from time to time. I’m happy that this thread was started personally, it’s giving me some good thinking matter let me say that.When ever asked about myself I say ‘woman/female/etc’..
On the occasions when the topic of “You’re not a woman” comes up, first show my passport that clearly states ‘female’ and that usually stops it, but in the even rarer event that is doesn’t, I describe myself as a ‘Transsexual’, and post/pre/non OP is avoided even when specifically asked with a “personally that’s non of your business, what do you want me to do drop my knickers and let you see?!” at this point the person usually gets the point they asked a very rude and personal question which they have no business knowing.
That said the conversation usually ensues results in questions about CD/TV/TS/TG which I feel that I have to explain, which is where the thread comes from in part. As Muffin put it, there is the aspect that we do not require labels (though some use them frequently) which is completely different from the general public.
The general public love labels, and want to use them all the time, therefore to prevent the huge amount of confusion on the subject we should ensure we present the labels consistently. The link that V provided is very useful, but from experience I know that it is written by people with a US centric view. This is not a bad thing, but it provides a source of confusion as the doctors and professionals I have spoken to in Aus and the UK (not to mention Malta who have no idea on the subject) is the view that I presented elsewhere. Personally I think it would be better to drop the definition of TV because that view distinguishes a TV as a CD that does it for sexual pleasure.. “What’s the point?” is my first thought. This will give the public that T* is a sexual thing and they are talking to a pervert of a freak… This is obviously damaging to the community as a whole. I think I showed this quite clearly on my MySpace page (which I know others have quoted me) where I state:
Quote:So as a transsexual you’re gay then…?Well apart from it being none of your business, don’t make assumptions. Most transsexual people are straight, I am not, I am gay I’m a lesbian who has BI tendencies. If you meet a T-Girl, post-op, she has a vagina and no male body parts… She will have her paperwork and documents all indicating she is female. If she has a husband, or boyfriend, is she gay or straight? The answer is she is straight, …
I guess this brings us back to the original point, and my conclusion is…
We don’t need labels. Others outside our community may or may not need labels, but they will nearly always use them. The labels are not consistent, and as a result (directly or indirectly) the “others” do not understand. Worse because there are some people who very publicly visible are porn stars or sexual deviants, not to mention the gay men that dress as women to perform the acts because they refuse to consider themselves as gay… the others assume most of us as freaks or perverts due to the lack of consistent information.
Should we do something about that?
Thank you all who have taken part in making this a sensible discussion, I was afraid (as was Amanda) that this was going to be a hot-topic in a bad way, and you have proven that we are all capable of thoughtful and intelligent discussion.
Shells
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Amy does point out that otherwise outwardly competent induhviduals can function in the world and “even” prosper while believing such idiocy.
These sort of attitudes, while not completely universal, are out there and do make anyone different feel like hell.I saw a gay comedian last night who found it safe to use a tranny as a butt of a joke. I was not impressed. The audience reaction did not make me feel like being “out”.
So where does that leave one? Labels of any kind are so retrograde, I cannot even begin to name the problem….
WHAT IS WRONG WITH being of any gender and wanting to appear in clothes of any type????
Why can’t I wear what I want without having to actually pick a label??? It really is none of anyone’s business if I am transitioning from male to female or if I just like to look un”drab”.
the ultimate question is why do I need a label past that of “my name is” …..?? Apparently I don’t need a “label” if I am wearing pants. If I wear a skirt I suddenly need a label?? Apparently I live in an enlightened society…. tee hee – I see the humour too but at times it does wear thin. Now back to the real world
Juliette
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i guess labels can have their humourous sides too.
looking at the national center for transgender equality definitions, i note there is one called two-spirit. i thought that was the first five minutes of happy hour. no offence intended, of course. actually, if you think being transgender is not much fun, try adding in being in an ethnic minority factor.
then there is the term, intersex. i was at a social function with an intersex person once. she presents as a female. we were talking to a couple of transwomen and my friend mentioned that she was intersex. the couple both shuffled their feet, looked at the floor and mumbled, yeah, so are we (obviously way over their heads).
and amy – i would partially agree with your colleagues’ view about transgender people not being able to produce sperm. some of the time, it’s because of too much two-spirit. other times, it may be because of the lack of attractiveness of the partner. but that’s an unverified assumption on my part.
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Hello all very interesting topic.I to tried to label myself.Am i a cd,tv ts etc until i was given wise advice.That was you are you,Your name is peta my wonderful friend and beautiful person that is who you are no labels.
I have held on to that ever since and no longer stress or worry about it,Hope that also helps -
Virginia, Hi darlz
I don’t want to go off topic with thisQuote:and amy – i would partially agree with your colleagues’ view about transgender people not being able to produce sperm. some of the time, it’s because of too much two-spirit. other times, it may be because of the lack of attractiveness of the partner. but that’s an unverified assumption on my part. Very HappyThat is a pure myth and perhaps should be explored by the Myth busters team
Even XXY transgender people, who are very rare, produce sperm biologically, example Ted/Chloe 60 mins report last year. Chloe has 2 children!You know what I’ve learned over the last 6 months, Transgenderism has nothing to do with biology or surgery, it’s all about Gender Identity, it’s how you feel inside!
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I feel that I must go in to bat for the term “trans” as a shortened form Of transgender ( as I use it a lot in my posts !! Imagine how I am saving on wear and tear of my keyboard everytime I save 6 letters!!) I do agree that if used to the General public , it is confusing but within the tent I would hope it is understood. Should I ever be asked ” trans what ? ” I will answer ,trans…fat!
My ex had a T..shirt once that read ” Label jars not people.”..all very nice but she still left me!! -
isn’t a post-op transexual just a woman? We don’t need a label for that!
yay … I can handle that.
cool, it what I have been telling the world.
xxx
Kelly Jones
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Hi Everyone
I would like to throw out a thought! Please be appropriate with your responses!
Is the word “Tranny” an appropriate “reference/label” for us in 2010?
From pervious posts , I know some of us dislike the term “trans”, “cross-
dresser”, “transvestite”, “transsexual” or other bullshit labels to describe us, however what about the term “Tranny”?Is there anyone out there who finds this offensive? Is it a derogatory reference that misrepresents the most of us? Just a thought?
Personally, I couldn’t care less what society thinks but I’m just curious what others think. Is the reference “Tranny “derogatory? How do you feel about it?
Just curious, thats all
Amy
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Lables are good for sugar and salt, But for me thats it! I see no sense in them myself other than we are all human and that sums it up for most here.
Many like myself at this point of there life have a car and house and all the legal as well as social crap that comes with it. In a nut shell labels are to pigion and square of lose details, look at you lic and insurance to most in legal terms you are a number, yet even we suffer the fate of lables.
Most are here because of a need, e to be as female as far as they can go,
Some will get to there goal and make the change to miss, for the rest of us its mix of legal, social, money woes that will stop us from going all the way past the points they are at now.A label does not make you anymore or anyless a woman. I don’t see why it should count in this day and age. But I guess a rose by any other name as the bard once said.
To each there own.
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I’ve decided to distance myself from the TG world as I feel there are just too many negative stigmas attached to it. If anyone asks I am just someone born with a hormonal issue that was easily fixed. That is all they need to know.
Yep no issues.. so meaningless it can me mentioned in passing. Life goes on. lalaaalalaalalalaaalalalaalalaaaaalaaaalaaaaaaaa .. ^___^ -
Hi,
Lables , i prefer not to have any ,other than what i am & yes its how people perseve us, so, what should i say im a transfemale with a male background who is a androgynous woman , Now thats really for the trans people .
For those i deal with every day im just a woman . & they have read my profile or seen me on our T V stations & the papers plus the net.
So i dont need to say much to people manlly those who would like to know why i am a woman yet knew me as a male well so called one , going back 50 years ,
As it was this week end my class mates of 1953, a school get to gether. 120 of our school turned up …yea was so neat.
they just accepted me as a woman,I dont hide my male background & why should i that s my past that has allowed me to be who i am now, its like my name they knew me as noel & now they know me as noeleena. & when i get called no-el thats still me .
So really my name reflects who i am & thats how people know who i am.
& so , what lable do i need other than noeleena.
& Do they accept because im different . well they accpted me on saterday night & we got on well so i would say yes . like most people do,
& will ,
I could say what im not & theres no point , because im accepted as i am.…noeleena…
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Hi Amy, I think one of the issues is that some post op girls including myself are finding just that. Even Tranny doesn’t sit well……just woman…no further reference required. I still think the nicest way to reflect the past is ‘a woman of transexual experience’ but ‘why reflect the past at all’ is a question a few of us are asking.
Gwen -
We could have a 1,000 boxes explaining the spectrum of transgnder people, and we will always have people saying I am 101.5. Each one of us is different. They bought out the term transgender to cover all gender variant people, but I am Kelly, just plain Kelly. (thanks Noeleena)
I agree with Gwen I am just a woman with a history that may differ a bit form other woman. In saying that one of my GG friends that I grew up with was and is a tom boy in a girlie body, that is into all the things I am into, like motor bikes, cars, makeup, excpet I ware skirts and she wares jeans. So I was born with a deformity that was corrected with surgery.
Tranny does not sit well with me at all. To me Tranny is a chick with a dick that is known to sell them selves for money on the street corner. Each time someone outside the TG world has called me a tranny they are eith asking me how much or are wanting to have a discreet affare with me, both leaving me feeling dirty and upset.
xxx
Kelly Jones
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Quote:Tranny does not sit well with me at all. To me Tranny is a chick with a dick that is known to sell them selves for money on the street corner. Each time someone outside the TG world has called me a tranny they are with asking me how much or are wanting to have a discreet affair with me, both leaving me feeling dirty and upset.
xxx
Kelly Jones
So true, which is one of the reasons I want to distance myself. It can be related to how all things transgender don’t fit into LGB(t) which has already been talked about I know. Being transsexual to me is so different to all other names that fall under the transgender umbrella. I have nothing at all in common with a crossdresser, dragqueen, tranvestite, tranny (what ever each individual considers that to really be) which I sure as hell know it’s not a TS.. is is that wishful thinking? ha!
To me a tranny is a transvestite but *shrugs* it really is subjective right, we’re too busy being swept under the carpet to have anything truly defined in concrete, perhaps…. I speculate.
Why is it that I feel so compelled to state such things? This is just my opinion<__< -
In answer to Amy’s question I personally have never been comfortable with the word Tranny. Kelly explained the reasons.
I also understand the meaning of this website as Amanda explained in another thread meaning Transistor Radio. Used in that context which was what is intended with a little logo of a old valve radio is clever.
Unfortunately in some peoples minds they don’t see it that way. 
