[Adrian]

Quote:

IHaving a supportive partner the subject has really never been brought up for discussion. Perhaps it should within my relationship.

A very good point. I assumed initially that having a “different” name would be useful in our relationship as a way of distinguishing the new behaviours and needs that my partner was exposed to.

But on the other hand it is useful to many to re-enforce to a partner that finding out about their gender diversity doesn’t make them a different person – they are still the person they first knew. In this context having a radically different name might send exactly the opposite message “goodbye to the Alan you knew… brace yourself and get to know Alison”

Now I have no need personally for a different name, my partner still likes to use the “femme” name to clarify the aspect of my personallity she is referring to.

We use names for so many purposes in a relationship!

[Adrian]

Caty,

I know for a fact that you wouldn’t be the only TgR member contemplating a forced hibernation through the summer.

But remember it isn’t necessary to have bare arms and legs to be cool in the summer. A long flowing cotton skirt looks very feminine and is often a lot more attractive than a pair of knobbly knees in shorts – and a white loose fitting wide sleeved cotton top is also a very practical alternative.

Take a look round the shops as the summer stock comes in and I’m sure you will find something suitable.

[Adrian]

My better nature tells me that replying to this would just be giving you oxygen. I have moved it to the sin bin as it is an example of the type of posting that has no place on TgR. Hopefully this will allow the original thread to remain as a useful discussion.

Quote:

Thus far no one shares your views on this Adrian – none who are willing to ”plaster” it on this forum in any case.

If forcing your views means stooping to threats in regards to membership then it says a lot more about you than me.

I agree, TGR Is not a democracy. Funny, I thought that is what this country was about. YOUR words Adrian not ours…..your attitude in this instance I feel is not in the spirit of this website which I always thought was about tolerance which democracy is suppose to be about
To me you have come across as a bully in this instance

[Adrian]

I’m unclear if you have looked at the resources already on the site…
but a quick look showed:

http://forum.tgr.net.au/cms/forum/F30/4712-712
Hair removal Newcastle recommending Maitland Laser Clinic , A.I Electrolgy in Wyee , Laser Clinic on Turton Road, near Hunter Sports Stadium. Also, their’s a Hair Clinic at Blackbutt shops,

http://forum.tgr.net.au/cms/forum/F30/1767-767
Electrolosis Sydney/Newcastle recommending A.I Electrolgy in Wyee

http://forum.tgr.net.au/cms/forum/F30/4010-010
Electrolysis & Face Rejuvenation – Sydney Recommendation – Nicolsons Electrolysis Balmain

I’m sure there are others that have been made in different forums.

Do you have some specific requirements that were not addressed by these earlier recommendations?

[Adrian]

Every time new life is breathed into this long running thread ( its been going since 2005) I wince at the original title.

Quote:

Are you crossdressing or seriously wanting to be a woman?

But, if you look back at the very first thread on the post there is nothing said that reflects the exclusivity – that you can either be crossdressing or seriously wanting to be a woman. but not both.

I know what Kiki meant when she started the thread (I think) but her terminology doesn’t sit easily with me. Crossdressing (wearing clothes intended/designed for the opposite sex) is one of the most common ways we externally express our gender identity and certainly isn’t reserved for those who don’t seriously want to be a woman.

As I expect this thread will carry on for a few more years I’ve renamed the title to reflect the original post and avoid the implication that those who seriously want to be a woman don’t crossdress.

The title has changed from the original

Quote:

Are you crossdressing or seriously wanting to be a woman?

to

Quote:

Are you happy being a man or seriously wanting to be a woman?

[Adrian]

I’d been thinking for some while of posting some more thoughts about choosing a name, but Ruth’s post has prompted me into action!

As Ruth says, choosing a name is often an important start in our journey of understanding ourselves.
But we often make that choice very early in our journey of discovery. Which means we choose a name without any real understanding of its implications for the future.

I suspect that I was not alone amongst many of our “older” members in having to choose a “femme” name on joining one of the support groups like Seahorse.
I guess that in these times, the choice often occurs when selecting an alternative email address or social media identity.

At this early stage in exploring our gender identity often secrecy and privacy are upper-most in our minds. And choosing a completely different “femme” name meets that need for anonymity.
With the first opportunities to express a more feminine gender, choosing a very “girly” name seems to underline the significance of the steps we are taking. As Ruth said it is ‘an important start in a journey”. It is a chance to say goodbye to boring drab David for a few hours and explore the exciting new future opining up for Gwendolyn!

For some of us, the opportunities to express a more feminine gender are confined to the internet, support group meetings or perhaps occasional outings in public. For someone forced to switch in this way between David and Gwendolyn that initial choice of name, with its re-enforcement of the split persona, may well remain appropriate and comfortable.

But for many others our journey of discovery leads us to present our gender identity more frequently. And in that context the name we first chose may no longer facilitate the changes we are looking for.

One of the early actions frequently taken by those who decide they wish to present a feminine persona to society is to change their name legally. Often this means legally selecting that same name chosen in the euphoria of coming out. Having worked through all the paperwork and official bureaucracy to change names on everything from academic qualifications to power bills it is perhaps too late to reflect on the appropriateness of that initial “femme” name!

So perhaps it is timely that I present a case for adopting less overtly “feminine” names.

A) A feminine name cannot change how you are perceived by others.
In many cases the harsh reality is that others will perceive you as a feminine male or a masculine female. If that is the case, then fewer questions will be asked if your name matches that perception. If you are called “Chris” then the name fits no matter what is read. A Gwendolyn with a deep male voice is asking for a little more acceptance.

For many (most?) of us our journey will not include changing physical sex. So for those who transition to express their gender full-time an unambiguously female name combined with a male sex is bound to cause practical difficulties with bureaucracy. It would be nice if we could change these stereotype associations overnight – and throw away with those forms asking for “sex” and the archaic salutations of Mr and Mrs. But without widespread change in society that initial feminine name can easily be a liability in everyday life.

C) There are many names that are perceived by society to be unisex. A recent informal survey we ran showed that maybe up to a 1/3 of TgR members have at least one legal name that is perceived as unisex. Just think how convenient it would be just to stick with that legal name as one goes forward on one’s journey of gender discovery. No issues with society over changes of name, or names not matching official records.
Though such a name would perhaps be seen as boring and unfeminine when first coming out – they can be far more practical for so many of the paths we find ourselves exploring later on.

So perhaps the onus should be on those who collect and encourage “femme” names to educate. We could make it clearer that femme names, far from being a necessity, may turn out to be a burden to carry on our exciting journey of gender discovery.

I feel a web site update coming on !!!!!

Adrian

[Adrian]

There are some comments that have been made about this article where it also appears on Daily Life.

http://www.dailylife.com.au/life-and-love/real-life/transsexuality-is-not-a-lifestyle-choice-20120907-25j21.html

The comments are all positive in their message.

One comment I particularly like, because it shows how complex this issue actually is:

Quote:

Good for Riley – it’s important to insist that your own view of yourself is the most important one and that others should defer to that unless it’s injurious to them or to the immediate health and well-being of the community.

However, just because you aren’t prompted or allowed to display behaviours reserved by cultural norm for the other sex shouldn’t have any bearing on your own ability to define yourself.

It would be nice if we could form an identity by choosing to display a variety of gender norms, rather than adopting the ‘opposite’ wholesale.

By being overtly ‘girly’ Riley’s actually reinforcing these gender norms – girls look like this, boys like this and it just so happens that she wants to be a girl as she understands it.

It’d be nice if Riley just felt free to be Riley – and if that’s in a dress but with male genitalia, or having an operation and dressing as a woman but retaining a legal male identity, then that’s really nobody else’s business.

The project of defining ourselves is hard enough without lugging a suitcase full of labels around!

It is lovely to see such truths being aired in the mainstream media.

[Adrian]

Quote:

So I now understand the need to know WHY ? and Erika’s list of questions ….and how I can confidently go to my daughter ‘ or anyone else for that matter’ and say this is WHY………….

I think there has been excellent advice offered already in this thread pointing very strongly that the WHY question that Erica is struggling with is not the way to go when educating the public.

There is very little chance of the WHY question being answered in our life time – and along with the other great mysteries of Life, The Universe and Everything you can resort to faith/religion for “answers” or you can just take a practical alternative and get on with your life.

Quote:

The easiest way that I know is to accept yourself for what you are, difficult at the best of times, and above all, smile and talk from the heart.

Quote:

my life became so much easier when I just accepted that my gender reality is just that – a reality.

Quote:

I was never really settled as a person until I accepted who and what I was

Quote:

I only need to tell them that this is how I perceive myself & feel, not ‘why’.

Quote:

So after all the why’s, it was why not! it is who I am and makes me a better human being in terms of being sensitive to others, tolerant, supportive, caring and empathic!

All the above are very sound, solid advice … and a far better foundation for healthy life than engaging in the endless search for “Why”.

So if others want to know Why… let them tell you first Why Not!

[Adrian]

August 2012 – another pleasant evening inside out of the cold wind.
A welcome to Shana and Chloe who were sampling the Glebe Cafe Night for the first time… and to our favourite waitress and photographer Katie who has returned from overseas.

Here is the picture – Catherine wasn’t hiding – she had to leave earlier…

[Adrian]

Ok – this is just my personal opinion…..

The cheap wigs look as if you are going to a Halloween party

The medium price range wigs nearly always look like wigs to me – partcularly on a more mature face.

I’m not sure why this is.. is it the acrylic fibre, the conservative US hair styles they use, or perhaps the way they ‘grow’ out of the head. I do know that the wigs which have coloured roots / tips look a bit more convincing in a way that a solid dark colour never does.

As Bambi said earlier in this thread – the Rolls-Royce of the wig industry is human hair – which can be styled and coloured in a way that makes them much less “wig-like”. But that comes with a price tag for purchase and maintenance that I doubt anyone would consider unless they proposed to wear it full time.

So it comes down to a bit of lottery – both in price paid and the style.
I’m not sure if trying wigs on in a shop (from a very limited range in stock) is better than ordering on-line and returning all the wigs that “don’t work”. But the challenge is working out when you have found something that is right (hint: get someone else’s opinion!). I don’t think in 15 or so years i ever cracked that one.

[Adrian]

Gina McKeon (who many of you may have met filming at TransFormal 2012) has produced a radio interview about the Transgender Sistergirl & Gender Diverse conference this weekend.

Listen to the interview here:
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/lifematters/transgender-health/4214968

As far as I can see there is no transcript available.

[Adrian]

I can’t see what the issue is with Gender Identity Dysphoria (which I can’t find used on the web anywhere) and Gender Dysphoria. But I can see that dropping the word “disorder” is potentially a big step forward in changing attitudes to the gender diverse. I was not alone in feeling that gender diversity should be de-pathologised.
http://forum.tgr.net.au/cms/forum/F347/4491-491

Up to now, a diagnosis of Gender Identity Disorder has rested on a psychologist being able to accurately determine the gender inside the “patient’s” head. We have discussed the concept of gender identity elsewhere in the forums.
http://forum.tgr.net.au/cms/forum/F157/4704-704

A common view is that defining gender identity labels and then accurately determining gender identity is almost meaningless as it rests entirely on the patient’s reported feelings and their personal understanding of gender. If you say “I feel essentially a woman” it is reasonable to ask “can you explain what you mean by feeling like a woman?”. There is little precision in the terms we use. To have the diagnosis of a disease or disorder resting on self-diagnosis by the patient under such ambiguous terms seemed strange to me. Little seems to have changed in this regard since Sandy Stone wrote about the flawed diagnostic process in 1987!
viewtopic.php?p=20122

With the change to definitions there is no longer a disease that is being diagnosed. I think this is potentially a big step forward for the community as a whole. There is no illness to treat – and so the ambiguity in any psychological diagnosis is probably less critical. I hope as a consequence many more gender diverse people will engage in a dialog with the medical profession. Gender diversity can perhaps now be shared without triggering a “treatment” process.

It also follows that if we haven’t got a disease then we don’t have to be cured. In this way we follow the path that the treatment of homosexuality took years before. Without the need for a cure then all surgery associated with gender dyspohoria can be argued to be cosmetic. To the extent that this may affect the affordability of surgical options there is a negative side to not being “sick”. This is an issue that will require careful attention.

However, the wider gender diverse community cannot both have the cake and eat it. Whilst people continue to seek “treatment” then society is unlikely to ever accept us as we are. Like the gay movement before us, we have to present in public as being proud and not ashamed of who we are. Carrying the stigma of needing to be cured sends the opposite message.

Acceptance is something that is of benefit to the entire gender diverse community. Through such a simple thing as redefining the psychological labels applied to us I think we may have moved a step closer to this goal.

[Adrian]

Quote:

I would find some of the topics interesting, but knowing how much time and effort is needed to prepare a presentation properly, I wonder if some presenters may be disappointed with the response to so much effort.

It would be good if the presentation could be made so as to be accessed at different times. If in summer and at 8pm in Sin City, it is only 5pm in the more civilised western third of the country so timing may be a problem for we underpriviledged few.

I don’t think the concept includes any presentation…and other than the fact that the transcript will be published afterwards it will be an on-line interactive session. So no need for lots of preparation before hand.
And it would have to be fairly late on the east coast to allow as many timezones to participate as possible.

Let me be totally definitive about the format given experience elsewhere and the feedback so far. Then we can move on from generalities and actually commit to topics – otherwise the idea is going no where.

=============================================

e-Seminar Provisional Format

WHERE
a) Will be held in the TgR chat room in a dedicated room

WHEN
b) On a weekday evening at a convenient time for all Australian mainland timezones

WHO
c) A group of “panelists” (speakers) will volunteer to share their experiences about the topic and to address any questions from “the audience”.
d) A facilitator will host the seminar – the facilitator will not participate in the discussion.
e) All members can log into the chat room and enter the seminar as “the audience”

WHAT
f) The topic of the eSeminar will be announced at least 2 weeks in advance and members will be invited to submit any questions in advance.

AGENDA
g) The seminar will start with a warm-up period when everyone can test their connections and feel comfortable in the room.
h) After the warm up period the seminar will be logged to a transcript that will be published afterwards (after editorial tidying up).
j) The facilitator will invite each panel member to share their personal thoughts on the topic (this is the only part that could be written in advance and cut&pasted into the chat)
j) The facilitator will then work through any questions that have been submitted – soliciting opinions from the panel.
k) “The audience” can at any time ask questions or offer an opinion. Posts from the audience will be held by the moderator and approved to appear at suitable times during the seminar.

=============================================

I do NOT want to discuss the mechanics any more at this stage.

What I am interested in is CONTENT.

To hold the first eSeminar I’m looking for 3 or 4 people who are prepared to be on the panel for a specified topic.

So to get this idea running… if you have topic(s) that you are prepared to be a panel member for please let me know. The topic can be one on the list above or a new one. Or you could indicate you are willing to be on the panel irrespective of what topic is chosen!

If we get a quorum we can try the first Seminar using the format above, and THEN discuss how we might change things subsequently.

[Adrian]

In summary this thread discussed a formalised seminar
– advertised well in advance
– to be held in the chat room
– with a moderator and preferably a guest speaker
– and a transcript published afterwards

We never reached the point in this thread of selecting suitable topics to discuss and discussion died a year ago.

In the meantime, I upgraded the chat room so it has the capability to host en e-Seminar if we wanted to.

And so the question is… we have the capability… do we want to try using it?

If so… what would be good topics.
And who might be prepared to act as the guest speaker to get things rolling

If we can get a topic and a speaker we can give it a try.

Topics:
Generally… good topics are one where the participants can share experience and ideas
Bad topics are ones that invite participants to disagree with each other and argue.

We could choose topics from the most popular threads in the foums:

Quote:

Tucking to get a smooth look
Make your own breast forms
Herbal breast enlargement
Taxi Club
Aarow Club
The Imperial Hotel Erskineville
How to get cleavage
Plucking Beard
The feminine voice
driving dressed
What is Passing about?

But many of these topics have limited appeal to the community as a whole

We could choose topics from the highest rated threads in the forums…

Quote:

Genie bras
Andropause – Friend or Foe?
Changing genders: Article from news.com.au
Transgender schoolgirl takes her exams

Or we could just choose general topics that we think will be of interest….

Quote:

Fashion- TransGender fashion tips, current fashion trends, colour co-ordination
Coming Out – Your experience in coming out the first time
What else???

If this thread dies a second time I’ll take it as a NO and remove the chat room feature.

[Adrian]

Whilst I will never be faced by the dilemma “Juliette” is faced with – I can comment on the case perhaps from the perspective of “John”.

As is so frequently the case with these potted agony aunt “problems” there is so much information that is not presented. For instance I’m curious if the questioner is bringing up the subject out of spite because she also fancies “John”. But if we are being asked for a hypothetical opinion then perhaps we can ignore the missing detail.

I think there are two issues that John could reasonably have a grievance about if “Juliette” decides to keep her past to herself.
The first is the disappointment when he, like many men, grows into being ready for a family – and finds that it is not possible.
The second is the breakdown in trust when, inevitably, he explores his partner’s missing past and finds the truth.

The first issue is not something faced alone by those who have changed their external physical sex. “Julliette” shares with all medically diagnosed infertile women the knowledge that she is unable to conceive. There is plenty of advice on the web for intersex and infertile women who find themselves in relationships. After reading the advice that is out there, I think Prudie is wrong to assert that “there is some information that potential partners are entitled to pretty early on”. Putting all the cards on the table in the way Prudie suggests would probably dampen any true relationship forming. However, I think it would be completely inappropriate for “Julliette” to enter into a serious partnership without sharing her infertility with “John”. So the advice is the same… only the timing is different.

The second issue is very specific to those who have a past life presenting as a different physical sex. In this case my hypothetical guidance is that every true relationship must be based on honesty. Honesty, does not mean telling your partner everything so you have no secrets. We all have secrets in our past that we rightly decide are burred in the past and not relevant to our life going forward. Rather, I think the obligation is to answer any question you are asked honestly…in other words to tell no lies. So once again, there is no timeline for putting all the past on the table.
I would hypothetically advise “Julliette” to acknowledge that there will come a time when “John” asks her a question and she has the option of lying, or outing her past. And I would advise her that telling the truth under these circumstances is the only way she can have a robust on-going relationship. So the timing will be determined by “John” not by “Juliette”. Of course if “John” is so naive as to not have any questions about Juliette’s past, and the topic of marriage is raised, then perhaps “Juliette” will have to initiate a bit of “education”.

There is only one part of Prudie’s advice that I can accept “as is”. And that is the opinion that a third-party should never “out” someone else.
This is something for “John” and “Juliette” to sort out between themselves.